[FirstClassSkeptic]

Or Utoya Island for Google.

What I notice about the two fuzzy pictures released by the police.

Neither one show any corpses. The Daily Mail says, Beware, Graphic pictures, but there's nothing there.

The one picture looks like there's foam rubber mats along the beach, and there's clothes, towels, coolers, and other stuff you normally find on a beach when everyone's in swimming.

The other picture shows white squares. The caption says, shooter walks among the slain. But there's nothing there. The White and gray squares aren't big enough to cover a body. And why would they cover them? Apparently the police did this as all online papers show the same squares.

The gunman was suppose to have several semi auto rifles, a shotgun and a pistol. And would necessarily have lots of ammo. The pictures show him with no gun whatsoever.

He is supposed to be wearing a police uniform, but it looks more like a motorcycle suit.

I don't really know if anyone is dead because all I have seen given as proof of there being dead people are pictures of people hugging each other, with a caption such as, survivors console each other. Maybe 82 people were taken captive to be slaves?

The man they show in the police car as being arrested doesn't look like the guy they say did it. He looks pretty close, but not quite right, for some reason.

[rerevisionist]

This is me trying to make sense of all this. Note that there was an exercise involving bombs, at more or less exactly the same time, in the centre of Oslo - compare this with an exercise carried out at exactly the time of 9/11; and an exercise involving tube trains in London on 7/7; also note that the police apparently knew the man, and spent something like two hours doing nothing, and he did it all solo, without training - probably simply not credible.

Without even attempting to assess all this, can I just make a small point - IF the main object was to kill Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg, the planners would have to have two media plans - one for 'success', one for 'failure'. So if it was the object, we are now seeing Plan B mode. .....

Here's a video by what looks/sounds like a 15 year old Geordie [i.e. someone from Newcastle, NE England] --
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPLxdRPUr2M
. .He says in effect this is an action in the same vein as 9/11, by Zionist Jews, the idea being to make all whites suspect and liable to arrest. (It's analogous to the way Jews in the Soviet Union used blanket labels - 'bourgeoisie', 'kulaks', 'class enemies' - to justify killing off opponents, who of course were white non-Jews). It might well be true. ....

The 'successful' killings and false flags - 9/11, 7/7, Kennedy, and sundry Europeans, no doubt Diana and Kelly and that recent Murdoch-related journalist, McVeigh, the collateral damage killing in the US - I forget the details, the one with the 'miraculous recovery' of someone shot at close range as a cover story ... all had the backup of corrupted legal systems, police, security, intelligence, and news. Maybe this doesn't apply in Norway? And of course you don't hear much of failed attempts. I still wonder whether the attempt to murder Thatcher wasn't also a Jewish thing via Ireland. Anyway, I was trying to imagine what the media would say if Stoltenberg had been murdered. No doubt some sort of arms clampdown

.....
I don't know how many people have downloaded his 'European Declaration of Independence' (Google for that and 2083 - I'm assuming the versions are identical).

It's very long and I think entirely assembled from Internet material, largely blogs such a Fjordmans. There's also a long section on defence and military stuff, also largely Internet-based. I haven't made much attempt to assess this - the version I heard is that the US security/ Y2K etc etc stuff is just a money-making scheme. I'd expect the militaria material to be subtly biased and unhelpful.

The majority part is an Internet history of Islam, most of which will be familiar to anyone interested in the topic. It includes e.g. demographic expansion and invasion - including accounts going back to 1900. It mentions the Hindu Kush, which of course is usually censored. And it mentions the Armenian genocide plus for good measure Greeks and Assyrians. There's material on the Quran and its related stuff - Hadiths, whatever. Some of this is quite good - e.g. the way Islam was favourably treated because the British disliked the Russian empire, and were willing, as now, to side with the shittiest allies.

What it doesn't have (of course?) is comment on anything Jewish. The author must have known that the Holocaust is a phoney - as of course many Muslims do. There's no comment on Jews in Turkey controlling the Armenian massacres. There's nothing on the USSR and Jews. There's rather sad material saying how the First World War wasn't that bad, and how wonderful Churchill was. There's nothing on Jewish domination of the media and academic worlds. Incidentally the whole presentation is European. There's also nothing on American-Jewish genocide in Vietnam - 1960s student radicalism is presented as a mere psychological oddity.

Anyway, the document is obviously not a serious analysis. My best guess is that part of the Jewish ubermensch types are concerned about Islam in Europe, and want to poke people into action. While of course the other part - I would guess largely American - push their policy with a sort of genetically-determined insanity. Maybe the document supports both at once - if there is white action, whether it fails or not, they can claim the document encouraged mistakes or was a key part of the movement.

BTW on Freemasons etc, my take is that Freemasons now are largely police and small businesses. Common Purpose is exactly the same sort of thing, but for bureaucrats, town planners, minor officials. I don't think the commanding heights need big organisations - the BBC, finance, big business, civil service and 'intelligence' bosses just need a few dinner tables and clubs.
........

Another small point: if you want to murder a few people, murdering a whole group hides it. Thus at Dunblane, a sex-abused child was offed - but this was hidden, because the entire class was shot at, and mostly killed. Similar thing: my personal belief is that the USS Indianapolis was ignored for a couple of days after being torpedoed on the way back across the Pacific, in 1945, because a few nosy US sailors had detected that the supposed A bombs on board were a fake. It's possible some of the mixed immigrants and Norwegians having their 'Labour Party' camp, and being 'groomed' to lead their brave new world, had decided to switch to a pro-Palestine and anti-Israel position; indeed this would make perfect sense from a genuine socialist point of view. Maybe they had stories to tell... it could have been part of the motivation for murder.

By the way also.. Breivik made quite a fuss about spending 300,000 - though on examination this proved to be partly income foregone by his research. The length of the document perhaps makes this credible. But it's just as likely the thing was thrown together in a few weeks or months since everything came from Internet. In the absence of firm evidence, watch out for the possibly false assumption this had been a long-term project.

It may have been written by someone British, in fact - it includes material on Andrew Neather, the Evening Substandard journalist [My little joke about a London 'newspaper'], who, almost alone, revealed the extend of the Labour Party's contempt for democracy when they secretly decided to allow unlimited immigration into Britain.

[FirstClassSkeptic]

One bright note: Israel offered medical assistance to Norway for the teenagers on the island, and was flatly turned down. It seems that Israeli organ trafficking is well known in Norway, it being a Norwegian paper, I read, that first brought it out.

I think this was a mossad operation. A few others have posted such also. Interestingly, as you say about police corruption; it's known that USA intelligence (read CIA) has hired retired Norwegian police to spy on Norwegians. This isn't conspiracy theory, but has been noted by Norwegian government. A German tourist was ferrying people from the island, and was told to STOP by the police.

Two days before this incident, there was a pro Palestinian rally on this island.

It was Giffords that was shot by Laugher in Arizona, and made a miraculous recovery, so much so that some have questioned if she ever was really shot. The real target was the federal judge, as you said; several were shot to cover one assassination.

See wellaware1.com for some interesting pictures about the Giffords shooting.

[FirstClassSkeptic]

The stories are getting more absurd. They are sounding like Holocaust stories. Common author, perhaps?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... reams.html

Killer listened to Lux Aeterna, by British composer Clint Mansell, describing it as inspiring and invoking the type of passionate rage within you.' Survivors described Breivik as 'wearing a headset' as he calmly fired on his unarmed targets.

Probably the several different IDF soldiers involved in the shooting were being coordinated by radio communications from a central point.

[rerevisionist]

I think the mossad thing is widely accepted.

I forgot to mention that another aspect of his 'European Declaration of Independence' is a list of nuclear power installations, as potential targets. I'm unsure how to interpret that, since from our viewpoint these things are likely not to be what they seem. Maybe yet another use for nuclear power is to provide supposedly dangerous buildings or areas which would justify military action? Perhaps the sites world wide were chosen partly for this.

[FirstClassSkeptic]

Nuclear plants are concentrated around population centers, so they would be a good place to position military.

The death toll has varied. I think it went to a high of 97. It was lingering around 82 yesterday. Today it's down to 63, I hear. I really haven't seen any proof that anyone died on the island. No pictures of the several guns he supposedly used have shown up. I'd guess that will be soon. Of course, no way to know where the guns came from.

There's now a picture of Breivat sitting in a police car. But to me, it doesn't match the earlier pictures. It's a fatter faced man. You could presume, older than the other pictures, and gained weight. But there's some bone structure that looks different, and the shape of the face.

I note also the brevity of pictures: Three of Breivat, one holding a rifle (which looks photoshopped by the way), all posed, studio looking pictures; one in the police car, and two fuzzy pictures from the helicopter of him, supposedly, as the shooter. No newspaper seems to have anything original, from their own photographers, if newspapers have such an animal these days as a photographer of their own.

Several people have asked the question as to why if the police could take a picture of him from a helicopter that they couldn't shoot him from the helicopter.

[FirstClassSkeptic]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPLxdRPUr2M

[FirstClassSkeptic]

https://translate.google.com/translate?h ... 41721.html

The shooter was talking on a headset.

[Sorensen731]

https://www.tribunadeeuropa.com/?p=8578

https://translate.google.es/translate?u= ... 3Fp%3D8578

In Spanish, used google translate, read the 3rd comment, it's the best summary of Israeli reasons to attack Norway

[rerevisionist]

Note: a longer and illustrated article a couple of days later is on this forum, several postings further on
https://www.big-lies.org/nuke-lies/www.nukelies.com/forum/Norway-Utoya-Island-Breivik-Israel-hate-2-of-2.html#norway

Thanks, Sorensen. Here it is in English machine translation - (apologies to non-English speakers) .. my bolds ....

Sports July 25, 2011 at 15:10 ['Sports' is a nickname; he/she is replying to 'Jesus']

Jesus

Some data of most interest (after I copy it to another forum):

Zionist involvement in the attacks to kill two birds with one stone: to punish Norway for positions contrary to Israel and, by the way, blaming the European nationalism through media network

The slaughter committed on July 22 in Norway took place in a context that is worth paying attention.

There have been two attacks, one against the seat of government and another on the island of Utøya with a two-hour difference between the two.

On the island of Utøya held a meeting-camp of the Youth League Workers' Labor Party (Arbeidaranes Ungdomsfylking, AUF, for its acronym in Norwegian) whose representative, Eskil Pedersen is one of the most important advocates of the boycott of Israel in Europe, and positions of great importance.

Boycott Israel

Norway's involvement in the boycott of Israel is fundamental and wounded sensibilities.

The academic boycott was led by one of the leading academic institutions in Norway, the University of Bergen, which intends to impose an academic boycott of Israel by conduct described as similar to apartheid (Ynet, January 24, 2010) , accompanied the governing board of the University of Trondheim, where they discussed and voted whether or not to join the academic boycott against Israel.

Just a few months, in April, the university boycott paid off and own Alan M. Dershowitz was in Norway and offered to give lectures on Israel in the three major universities, but all rejected his offer, although they had been invited there Ilan Pappe, or Stephen Walt.

Desrhowitz's complaint against "Norway to boycott pro-Israel speakers" can be read on the following link: https://soysionista.blogspot.com/2011/04 ... s-oradores -pro.html .

The Foreign Minister of Norway, Jonas Gahr Støre said this the day before the slaughter:

"The occupation must end, the wall should be demolished and do it already" ... and did so in the same camp where the massacre took place (source: https://tinyurl.com/3zhsj4w) .

The AUF calls to boycott Israel. Jonas Gahr Store, Foreign Minister of Norway, was received Thursday at the summer camp that takes place in AUF Utøya, where he heard the request to Norway to recognize the Palestinian state.

There the minister toured the camp organized by Eskil Pedersen, leader of the AUF (Reuters).

Last Wednesday, Eskil Pedersen said that the Workers' Youth League (AUF) that Norway wants to impose a unilateral economic embargo on Israel.

"The Workers' Youth League will have a more active policy in the Middle East and we have to recognize Palestine.

"Money is only money," now we need to push the peace process into another lane, "said Pedersen.

Shares of BDS (boycott, divestment and sanctions) were endorsed in January 2006 by Minister of Economy ( https://www.elreloj.com/article.php?id=16385 ) and have been paid in divestment . Specifically, the August 23, 2010 Norway reported that the Norwegian Petroleum Fund (Norway Oil Fund) withdrew their investments from international construction company Danya Cebus, which belongs to the bottom of Africa-Israel Investments.

In the words of the Minister of Finance "The Board of Ethics emphasizes that the construction in settlements in the occupied territories is a violation of the Geneva Convention on the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War," he said.

"Several resolutions of the Security Council of the United Nations and opinions of the International Court of Justice have concluded that the construction in Israeli settlements in the occupied Palestinian territories is prohibited under this Convention," said Economy Minister Sigbjoern Johnsen said in a statement".

The divestment has also spread to the arms deal, and in September 2009 was canceled investment in Elbit, the Israeli arms company

And not only have banned the sale of arms to Israel, but in June 2010 the Norwegian Minister of Eucación made ??an international appeal for this position to boycott Israeli arms companies were shared by the rest of the international community ( http: / / https://www.swedishwire.com/nordic/4809- ... -to-israel ) before the assassination by Israel of nine Turkish activists in the attack on the flotilla.

The Norwegian boycott is supported massively by the population and, according to Israeli sources, in 2010 40 percent of Norwegians and Norwegian refused to buy Israeli products ( https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0.7340.L -3898052.00.html )

Support for the Palestinian people

If Norway has excelled in the boycott of Israel, so has to declare and recognize the Palestinian state.

On July 19, Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas visited Norway and the Norwegian Foreign Minister Jonas Gahr Støre told the TV2 news that Norway is willing to recognize the Palestinian state.

Those words are repeated during which Utøya chat: "We are ready to recognize the Palestinian state.

I'm waiting for the actual wording of the resolution that the Palestinians will present to the UN General Assembly in the month of September"
(source: https://english.ruvr.ru/2011/07/19/53408557. html) .

In autumn it is expected that Palestinian President Abbas Mahmound raise the issue to the UN, which prompted admission to the organization and recognition of Palestinian state according to the prewar borders of 1967 with capital in East Jerusalem.

Neither the U.S. nor Europe support the creation of an independent Palestinian state.

In addition, former Foreign Minister, Kare Willoch, have recently given a Palestinian passport and expressed support for the Palestinians and their situation:

"I've noticed the very grave injustice that has been subjected the Palestinian people and really the entire Western world has a responsibility in it"
(source: https://theforeigner.no/pages/news/abbas ... -minister/ ).

Reactions in Israel

Israel is aware of these actions. In fact, November 15, 2010 the Israeli press reported that "incites hatred Norway against us" (source: ynetnews.com), which resulted in a serious diplomatic conflict. Israel accused the Norwegian government to fund and promote blatant incitement against Israel.

In that case the complaint was for funding and participation of Norway in the dissemination of works that report the suffering of children in Gaza.

This was the full text of the news:

According to reports received by the Minister of Foreign Affairs in Jerusalem, the municipality of Trondheim financed a trip to New York for students involved in the Gaza Monologues, "which deals with the suffering of children in Gaza following the Israeli occupation '.

The play, written by a Palestinian from Gaza, will be presented at the UN headquarters. The function adds an exposure to a Norwegian artist exhibited in Damascus, Beirut and Amman in cooperation with Norwegian embassies in Syria, Lebanon and Jordan.

The exhibition shows dead Palestinian babies with Israel's Army helmets reminiscent of the helmets Nazi soldiers and an Israeli flag drenched in blood.

The Norwegians also help distribute at film festivals around the world a documentary entitled Tears of Gaza ("Tears of Gaza"). According to Minister of Foreign Affairs, the film also deals with the suffering of children in Gaza without mentioning Hamas rockets fired at Israel and the right of the latter to defend itself.

In the film are Gazans Itbah al-Yahud singing, but the Norwegian translation says "Israeli massacre" instead of "slaughter the Jews."

It has also recently published a book written by two Norwegian doctors were the only foreigners in Gaza gave interviews during the Cast Lead. [=Hail of bullets? - rerev] The book, which accuses Israel Army soldiers of deliberately killing women and children, is a bestseller in Norway and has been warmly recommended by none other than the Norwegian Foreign Minister Jonas Gahr Støre.

The Israeli embassy in Norway has strongly protested against the involvement of authorities in the demonization of Israel. "The official policy of Norway and expressed understanding and reconciliation talks said on Sunday night an Israeli authority, but since the war in Gaza, Norway has become a superpower in regard to export-oriented multimedia delegitimize Israel while using the Norwegian taxpayer money to produce and disseminate those materials. "

Avalon Daniel, vice-minister of Foreign Affairs, said in a meeting with members of the Norwegian Parliament that "this type of activity away from the possibilities of reconciliation and promotes radicalization of the Palestinian position that prevents them from negotiating."

The Norwegians have responded to Israeli criticism saying the government supports freedom of expression and not intervene to alter the content of works of art.

Source; https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0, 7340, L-3984621, 00.html

The Israeli press has published more papers noting that relations between the two countries definitely do not pass their prime.

Should be added that Norway has held talks with Hamas since it formed a unity government in 2007, thus moving away from U.S. and European position and deeply troubling to Israel, as expected ( https://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6470669.stm ).

The bad relations become a highlight in the President's own statements of Israel, Shimon Peres, who in May 2011 said that dialogue with Hamas is to support this terrorist organization, to which Jonas Gahr Store-Norwegian Foreign Minister - said, "we condemn organizations that are involved in terrorism, but Norway considers that having a few lists that include a so-called terrorist organization does not serve our goals"
( https://www.newsinenglish.no/ 2011/05/06/peres-criticizes-norway-on-hamas / ).

It seems that Norwegians who are putting on the table "definition of terrorism," a simple label that gives its name to a list and immediately condemn millions of people to a genocidal blockade or a deadly attack.

Interestingly, the "terrorist" accused of the slaughter Norwegian Anders Breivik Behring, is being mentioned as a supporter of a blog called "Fjordman" take time and their messages appear with links to Jihad Watch, Gates of Vienna

If so, Fjordman's blog shows that an extremist would Breivic neocon who hates especially Muslims, and also pro-Israeli, see the blog, "why Israel's struggle is also our struggle" ( https://vladtepesblog.com /? p = 21 434 ).

Could it be that in the end, the tentacles of the State of Israel are not so far away from this carnage, the end of the day would not have been the first to commit, nor, unfortunately, be the last.

Yes, the Norwegian Workers Youth League (AUF), the Norwegian Foreign Minister and his government have received a tremendous full blow.

Just who are positioned over the rejection of the genocidal policy of Israel towards the Palestinian people are suffering the most, previously warned by Israel of its "tremendous courage" ... something in Israeli parlance means you pay the consequences

[FirstClassSkeptic]

To make matters murkier, much of his 1,500 page manifesto was directly lifted from the infamous Theodore Kaczynski, better known as “the Unabomber”.

Nearly one dozen passages were directly copied from the Unabomber’s manifesto without attribution and with the only changes being the exchanges of some words to match Breivik’s rhetoric.

This was discovered by some observant Norwegian bloggers and was utilized by the mainstream Western media not to question the validity and providence of Breivik’s manifesto but instead to reinforce the contrived Unabomber-Breivik connection.

https://endthelie.com/2011/07/24/analyzi ... z1TGaEt3HB

[rerevisionist]

May be worth noting-
Anders means 'Others' in German; conceivably there's some name changing here (as with 'Gunther Anders')